Happiness>Intelligence?

[tman]

So this topic popped into my head while in the Novel board...

Why read and made up story when you can learn about something that exists in our realm?

I don't think the two can really be compared. Why watch a movie/TV show when you can watch a documentary and learn something?

In any case, it has helped me fall asleep easier to read a fictional book before bedtime. I always had a pretty hard time with it, because I can't switch of my mind, and I end up pondering on stuff instead of sleeping. Reading non-fiction only adds to that, since it would just keep me up thinking about the information I just absorbed.

As I also struggle with this situation I will bring it further as well. I find that I read so much of what is 'real' or truthful that it actually makes me unhappy or unfulfilled with life. So it poses the question...

Does one sacrifice their intelligence in order to be happy?

I would like to refute any such notion; however, from my experience the more I learn the less happy I become. This ranges from all sorts of topics with personal emphasis on physics, psychology, and spirituality.

[Mr. T]

Yeah I'm about to graduate from university and for years I was near suicidally depressed, or insane, and seeked to numb the flow of information with dozens of different drugs. But I'm as mentally active as even these days and yet the happiest I've ever been, I think it's all about how you deal with it. My brain fiends information, and I found that when I tried to block the flow it would start to make my thoughts overly dense and loopy, bringing me down. I find the only thing to do is try to understand the world as it is, so you can understand your place it, than the feeling of being out of place is reduced. Or if it's not, it's at least something you acknowledge and know the limits of.

[FF...]

I agree that it's good to keep learning new things and it's not that you should sacrifice one for the other, but that you should find a balance that works for you. If you feel unhappy and unfulfilled with life, then I would say that all your learning isn't beneficial to you at all. Would you rather look back on your life and be proud of all the information you gathered or be fulfilled by the happiness you felt and spread?

I think it's true that we should always keep challenging ourselves and keeping your nose in the books isn't the best way to go about it. It's better to put the information into practice and focus on a goal you set for yourself. I would say this would be much more fulfilling than just learning about it, and it will definitely help you understand the information. What is it you are trying to achieve with all this learning?

Anyway, to answer the main question, I value happiness more than intelligence. I'm almost done with school, and I'm pretty sure I'm not going to work in the field I've now been trained in. The job I have on the side doesn't require much learning and it will probably never pay as much, but I enjoy doing it, and it challenges me in different ways. For instance, I'm not one for small talk, but I'm being pushed to have positive social interactions with strangers. One might say this is training my social intelligence.

I say, find something that you love doing and do it. Time is the most valuable commodity, after all. You shouldn't waste it on things that don't fulfill you. Unfortunately that's a lesson I only just recently learned.

[Amanroth]

I would have to agree with most of what FF just said. I myself have graduated from college, but eventually I intend to go back. I took business, and despite the notion that I will eventually be running several of my own business, I didn't take the courses in order to go with a career in that field. Most of the people in my classes were the types who planned to become managers or executives of larger companies, whereas I was only there to absorb as much information about the ups and downs of the business world as I could. I also took some music theory courses, and looking through the course list I can see several other degrees that I would enjoy obtaining. However, I'm not willing to spend the time or the money to go back to school to gain those degrees, as I would never do anything with them. I simply crave the information. I have a great interest in always furthering my knowledge, and expanding my experiences and abilities. Simply put, I wouldn't go for a PhD in astrophysics, but it's something I am always trying to learn more about.

The hunger for knowledge is what drives me to read and do my own research. The acquisition of same knowledge is what makes me happy. I enjoy being what I would consider to be an intellectual, but I would never forfeit my own happiness in order to learn more. I can read about physics and chemistry and learn about it without fully comprehending all the complex equations that go into it and just accept it for what it is.

I find happiness to be more important ad valuable than intelligence, but you shouldn't necessarily be sacrificing one to save the other. For example, I can adequately discuss world history or theoretical physics with certain friends while we numb our brains watching The Simpsons. I won't lie and say we know all there is to know about the subjects, but we sure as * enjoy feeding off eachother's experiences and knowledge.

To bring the point home, I DO understand what you mean, when you say "I find that I read so much of what is 'real' or truthful that it actually makes me unhappy or unfulfilled with life." There are many factors involved here. One of them is that the more you learn, the more you realize how little you actually know. I think some people are content to just scrape by with the bare minimum, and it's kind of depressing because that is a good chunk of the population, and that unfortunately is what is 'real'. It's hard to stimulate your mind when everyone around you is talking about whether Ashton Kutcher is better on Two and a Half Men than Charlie Sheen. The truth about our world and our universe is generally rather ugly, in that we are so insignificant and the only thing people care to talk about is what movies and TV shows they've seen lately.

That being said, NEVER sacrifice intelligence for happiness because even though ignorance is bliss, I truly believe that there's nothing that can possibly make a person happier than when they can share deep philosophical and scientific thoughts with other intellectuals.

[FF...]

The hunger for knowledge is what drives me to read and do my own research. The acquisition of same knowledge is what makes me happy. I enjoy being what I would consider to be an intellectual, but I would never forfeit my own happiness in order to learn more. I can read about physics and chemistry and learn about it without fully comprehending all the complex equations that go into it and just accept it for what it is.

I'm curious to know how gaining knowledge gains you happiness. I find them two rather separate ideas. What about it makes you feel happy? I wanted to comment on this, but felt it was a bit presumptuous. So I would like to understand your perspective.

To bring the point home, I DO understand what you mean, when you say "I find that I read so much of what is 'real' or truthful that it actually makes me unhappy or unfulfilled with life." There are many factors involved here. One of them is that the more you learn, the more you realize how little you actually know. I think some people are content to just scrape by with the bare minimum, and it's kind of depressing because that is a good chunk of the population, and that unfortunately is what is 'real'. It's hard to stimulate your mind when everyone around you is talking about whether Ashton Kutcher is better on Two and a Half Men than Charlie Sheen. The truth about our world and our universe is generally rather ugly, in that we are so insignificant and the only thing people care to talk about is what movies and TV shows they've seen lately.

I agree that most small talk isn't exactly mentally stimulating, and I would say that the issue isn't with people not being intelligent, but with them having different conversational interests than you. Your posts tells me that you are interested in talking about topics that you consider intellectual, but at the same time you look down on people discussing their own interests. If someone were to overhear one of your intellectual conversations and decide you were a pompous *, would you consider them to be judgemental? You're doing the same thing.

You say acquiring knowledge makes you happy, but that does not mean the rest of the world needs to feel the same way. You don't think everyone is entitled to find their own source of happiness?

In any case, however you feel about this, it shouldn't be depressing to you. You shouldn't base your emotions on the actions of other people. You only have control over yourself. Don't concentrate on the world, but appreciate yourself. SELF HELP BOOK'D!

That being said, NEVER sacrifice intelligence for happiness because even though ignorance is bliss, I truly believe that there's nothing that can possibly make a person happier than when they can share deep philosophical and scientific thoughts with other intellectuals.

Truly?

We have a completely opposing perspective on happiness, I think. I would say it lies in the simpler things of life.

[Amanroth]

The hunger for knowledge is what drives me to read and do my own research. The acquisition of same knowledge is what makes me happy. I enjoy being what I would consider to be an intellectual, but I would never forfeit my own happiness in order to learn more. I can read about physics and chemistry and learn about it without fully comprehending all the complex equations that go into it and just accept it for what it is.

I'm curious to know how gaining knowledge gains you happiness. I find them two rather separate ideas. What about it makes you feel happy? I wanted to comment on this, but felt it was a bit presumptuous. So I would like to understand your perspective.

To bring the point home, I DO understand what you mean, when you say "I find that I read so much of what is 'real' or truthful that it actually makes me unhappy or unfulfilled with life." There are many factors involved here. One of them is that the more you learn, the more you realize how little you actually know. I think some people are content to just scrape by with the bare minimum, and it's kind of depressing because that is a good chunk of the population, and that unfortunately is what is 'real'. It's hard to stimulate your mind when everyone around you is talking about whether Ashton Kutcher is better on Two and a Half Men than Charlie Sheen. The truth about our world and our universe is generally rather ugly, in that we are so insignificant and the only thing people care to talk about is what movies and TV shows they've seen lately.

I agree that most small talk isn't exactly mentally stimulating, and I would say that the issue isn't with people not being intelligent, but with them having different conversational interests than you. Your posts tells me that you are interested in talking about topics that you consider intellectual, but at the same time you look down on people discussing their own interests. If someone were to overhear one of your intellectual conversations and decide you were a pompous *, would you consider them to be judgemental? You're doing the same thing.

You say acquiring knowledge makes you happy, but that does not mean the rest of the world needs to feel the same way. You don't think everyone is entitled to find their own source of happiness?

In any case, however you feel about this, it shouldn't be depressing to you. You shouldn't base your emotions on the actions of other people. You only have control over yourself. Don't concentrate on the world, but appreciate yourself. SELF HELP BOOK'D!

That being said, NEVER sacrifice intelligence for happiness because even though ignorance is bliss, I truly believe that there's nothing that can possibly make a person happier than when they can share deep philosophical and scientific thoughts with other intellectuals.

Truly?

We have a completely opposing perspective on happiness, I think. I would say it lies in the simpler things of life.

Let me explain a bit better because I think you're reading me incorrectly. When I say that gaining knowledge makes me happy, it's because I enjoy learning new things. Not just about life, love, scientific discovery, etc, but also about myself and other people. I really do enjoy learning, and having conversations with other people (whether I would consider them to be intellectual or not) helps me to do so. This isn't the ONLY thing that makes me happy, mind you. I like my video games, music, movies, sports, partying, all that jazz. I see happiness and intelligence as separate concepts as well, but these concepts can be joined together if one so wishes. I could sit and read a good fictional book and gain as much enjoyment out of it as reading a work of non-fiction, you know what I mean?

How do my posts tell you that I'm only interested in topics I consider intellectual? What posts have I made that ever gave you that presumption? Realistically, no, most small talk isn't mentally stimulating, but I wouldn't consider most of the threads on any message board to be small talk. I don't need to have an intellectual conversation in order to enjoy talking to someone, I mean I enjoy having conversations with everyone on this forum, and I wouldn't speculate that all of you have similar interests to myself. For a long time I have run with the notion that nobody is really stupid, there are just different forms of smart. For instance, I can't build an engine, and someone who can may consider me stupid, or at least lacking intelligence in that area. However, I can build a computer, and I would never think of anyone who can't to be dumb. This doesn't mean I can't enjoy hearing them talk about their fortes and that they can't enjoy hearing me talk about mine.

What ever gave you the idea that I look down on people discussing their own interests? I implore you to show me some example of me EVER looking down on someone for any reason. I don't have the means to turn my nose up at people because I have never viewed anyone as beneath me or above me, I see people on equal ground, unless you do something to really * me off haha. I can't help but feel like you think I'm some pompous * for some reason that I can't quite understand. Sure I love to discuss my favorite music and my interests, but who doesn't? I would never scoff at you or anyone else for doing so. So please, if I have ever given you this impression, I ask you to explain how and why because it's completely unintentional on my part.

I would indeed consider someone to be judgemental if they thought I was an * because they didn't value the things I value. That would be extremely judgemental of them to do so. They can certainly value different things than I do without thinking less of me, and I don't do that to anybody else. I'm definitely not trying to say that my viewpoint is for everyone. I was simply trying to establish that happiness and intelligence is a lot like a balancing act. I even said "but I would never forfeit my own happiness in order to learn more". I won't go out of my way to be more intelligent if it's going to make me unhappy, and I don't think anybody should. Everyone IS entitled to their own source of happiness, but there should be a level of intelligence that goes along with it, hence why I said it shouldn't be sacrificed. I was trying to juxtapose the two because I don't think it's great for someone to purposely dumb themselves down just to fit in with people or to be more content with their station in life, and I think that's really the topic of discussion here. It seems to me that was what tman was getting at, but forgive me if I completely missed the point.

I believe EVERYONE deserves to be happy, and should always do what makes them happy. Let me clear that up right now because I think you got the wrong impression based on what I said before. I just think there's a balance. What I was trying to say is that you ought to know where the point of balance is, and neither should be sacrificed for the sake of the other. I believe intelligence is important because it can lead to happiness, but having fun is equally important to happiness. They are separate but one may still affect the other at a certain point. The simple things are extremely important to my happiness as well.

[Amanroth]

I just re-read what you had said before and then re-read what I said. I'm seeing virtually no difference in our responses, mine was just more long-winded than yours. I pretty much agreed with you FF, and then proceeded to explain why I agreed with you. How do you figure we have different viewpoints? I think you just misunderstood what I said, or maybe I didn't explain myself very well.

I do hope you don't actually think I look down on anybody though. That part of your last post is what really got to me. I don't believe I've ever done anything to make that apparent. I suppose that my post about Jersey Shore could come off that way, but it wasn't intended to be taken literally, just as an observation about what passes for TV.

[tman]

Yeah I'm about to graduate from university and for years I was near suicidally depressed, or insane, and seeked to numb the flow of information with dozens of different drugs. But I'm as mentally active as even these days and yet the happiest I've ever been, I think it's all about how you deal with it. My brain fiends information, and I found that when I tried to block the flow it would start to make my thoughts overly dense and loopy, bringing me down. I find the only thing to do is try to understand the world as it is, so you can understand your place it, than the feeling of being out of place is reduced. Or if it's not, it's at least something you acknowledge and know the limits of.

This situation seems very similar to my own (the drugs and whatnot). As I have recently determined with the help of a therapist and doctors that years of substance abuse has offset my brain chemistry. Mix that with a predisposition towards poor mental health (i.e. bipolar disorder, and depression) via genetics that I am unhappy because of my flawed and abused brain. The intelligence factor just adds to that but I was wrong to blame it as the source of being unhappy. There is a man named Neil deGrasse Tyson who did an AMA on reddit a couple days ago that had some good words to say...

The problem, often not discovered until late in life, is that when you look for things like love, meaning, motivation, it implies they are sitting behind a tree or under a rock. The most successful people recognize, that in life they create their own love, they manufacture their own meaning, they generate their own motivation.
For me, I am driven by two main philosophies, know more today about the world than I knew yesterday. And along the way, lessen the suffering of others. You'd be surprised how far that gets you.

I believe this quote to be quite an accurate depiction on life as a generality. His philosophy on the matter is very simple yet inspiring.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neil_deGrasse_Tyson

http://www.haydenplanetarium.org/tyson/

[The009]

HOLY WALL OF TEXT BATTHUMB.

To be honest you cant have happiness without some Intelligence. IMO

But then again there are some that say that wisdom is the key to happiness.

[FF...]

How do my posts tell you that I'm only interested in topics I consider intellectual? What posts have I made that ever gave you that presumption? Realistically, no, most small talk isn't mentally stimulating, but I wouldn't consider most of the threads on any message board to be small talk. I don't need to have an intellectual conversation in order to enjoy talking to someone, I mean I enjoy having conversations with everyone on this forum, and I wouldn't speculate that all of you have similar interests to myself. For a long time I have run with the notion that nobody is really stupid, there are just different forms of smart. For instance, I can't build an engine, and someone who can may consider me stupid, or at least lacking intelligence in that area. However, I can build a computer, and I would never think of anyone who can't to be dumb. This doesn't mean I can't enjoy hearing them talk about their fortes and that they can't enjoy hearing me talk about mine.

Whoops, that was supposed to be post. I was only reacting to your post in this thread. I don't think it's your only interest, but you mentioned in your post that you enjoy it.

What ever gave you the idea that I look down on people discussing their own interests? I implore you to show me some example of me EVER looking down on someone for any reason. I don't have the means to turn my nose up at people because I have never viewed anyone as beneath me or above me, I see people on equal ground, unless you do something to really * me off haha. I can't help but feel like you think I'm some pompous * for some reason that I can't quite understand. Sure I love to discuss my favorite music and my interests, but who doesn't? I would never scoff at you or anyone else for doing so. So please, if I have ever given you this impression, I ask you to explain how and why because it's completely unintentional on my part.

Again, that was a response to what you said in the paragraph I quoted. The part where you said how ugly it was that everyone just talks about their favorite movie/TV show. It struck me as somewhat judgmental, but I suppose you meant it differently. I would never base my opinion of you on one comment though. In fact, I thought it was rather unlike you, but I figured it had been years since we really talked.

I don't think you're a pompous *. If I did, trust me that I would tell you directly, and not in such a wishy washy way. I was just trying to convey that if someone judged you in the same way that I thought you were judging the world's population, that you would realize that you were being judgmental. I was hoping that you'd then be cured of your judgement and we would all live happily ever after in a green garden paradise with fluffy creates to cuddle and a rainbow having a permanent location in the sky. But alas, apparently there was never judgment to begin with, so no rainbow

I didn't mean any offense.

I just re-read what you had said before and then re-read what I said. I'm seeing virtually no difference in our responses, mine was just more long-winded than yours. I pretty much agreed with you FF, and then proceeded to explain why I agreed with you. How do you figure we have different viewpoints? I think you just misunderstood what I said, or maybe I didn't explain myself very well.

Another direct response to the part of your post I quoted. You said there's nothing that can possibly make a person happier than when they can share deep philosophical and scientific thoughts with other intellectuals. I agree that may be true for you and I would say happiness doesn't rely on anything scientific or anything intellectual at all, but on emotion.